are there greater and lesser sins?

[thunderbyrd]

are some sins worse than others? or not? i think i know the answer to this question, but i would like to see Scripture that proves it, one way or another.

[scooteraz]

So far as I know there is only one unpardonable sin, and that is the deliberate refusal of the work of the Holy Spirit.

Mark 3 and Mathew 12.

All other sins are pardonable. So from that point of view, then that one sin is worse, and all others are lessor.

However, if I look at the question a different way, can I be saved with any UNPARDONED sin in my account? The answer is no, so all sins are equal.

This is a point of view question.

[MusicChad]

They way I've always looked at this question is this way:

From our perspective, there are sins which are more heinous than others... For example, most would say that murder is worse than telling a "little white lie", etc. etc.

That being said, when you really understand the Holiness of God and how woefully short we all fall of achieving the standards required of us that the difference are essentially irrelevant from God's perspective.

A good analogy would be this:

If you get a bunch of people and ask them to throw a rock as far as they can, some will undoubtedly be able to fling it further than others. If the goal of the contest is to throw your rock to the planet Neptune, than everyone’s attempt falls so incredibly short of the goal that it doesn’t matter. You are looking at an unbelievably microscopic difference percentage wise between the furthest throw and the shortest.

In that same way, when we consider our attempts to “please God” or to satisfy the requirements of “holy living” on our own, we stand zero chance… (Without faith it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God…)

If one believe that sin is just a small “tiff” between you and God than that individual doesn’t have a clear understanding of sin or of holiness. It is only when we realize that sin is OFFENSIVE to God and creates a chasm so wide that the only way to satisfy the penalty is through DEATH, we start to get a better sense of it all. Realize also that Jesus taught the Pharisees (who were EXTREME in their efforts to uphold “the law”) that even their efforts were woefully insufficient – after all to even “think” about another man’s wife was to commit adultery, etc. etc. etc.

The cool part is that when we realize how significant the “sin problem” is and that we will NEVER be able to pay for our sins on our own causing us to face death and eternal separation from God, the salvation offered to those who believe becomes even more wonderful!

When we properly capture “sin”, it allows us to properly grasp “grace” and “mercy” as well! Thanks be to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ who FREELY offers forgiveness to all who believe! Not only are your sins forgiven – HIS RIGHTREOUSNESS IS CREDITED TO YOUR ACCOUNT!!!! How sweet is that!!!??!?!?!??

Thinking about “sin” and the substitutionary atonement offered to those who believe absolutely drives me to worship!!!! (to respond to who God is and what He has done for us!!!) When I get this in perspective, I passionately desire to serve God out of a heart of thankfulness.

My advice would be to not focus on what sins are “worse” or how one individual compares to another… I’d focus on Romans 3:23 which shows as that ALL people fall short of the glory of God and then follow that up with a good dose of verses like (and pardon the paraphrases here):

Romans 5:8 – God showed His love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us!

Romans 6:23 – For the wages of sin is death: (not just “some” sins… ALL sins) but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 10:9 – If you confess with your moth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead – You SHALL BE SAVED!!!

Romans 10:13 – WHOEVER calls upon the name of the Lord SHALL BE SAVED!!!!



In summary – the bad news is that we are in big trouble when it comes to sin… regardless of the sin… whether it is “big” or “small” from our perspective, we are desperately lost. The good news is that there is a way for us to be granted forgiveness… …and ANYONE can do it!!!!!

[hasserl]

I would say that some sin has a worse effect on our neighbor than other sin, but to a holy God all sin is deserving of condemnation. Re the example given above, murder & white lies; obviously murder has a much worse effect on our fellow men than white lies do. But sin is sin, doesn't matter how bad it is, it still makes one unworthy of salvation.

[LesStrat]

"It takes the same amount of blood to cover gossip as it does murder."--Pastor Paul Neel

[jrc]

I think our reaction to the sin is what matters ultimately. 1 John describes " sin leading to death and sin not leading to death". If we carry on in sin as a lifestyle then that, to my way of thinking, would be sin leading to death. And, as it's written He is quick to forgive if we confess it and repent.

I don't think God makes a distinction - it's all filth to him, the degree of which is of no concern.

[mattd]

James 2:10 says "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all."

That's the simplest verse I can think of to answer your question. There's an interesting book out there called "The Respectable Sins" that addresses this topic, if you want to read more.

[scooteraz]

So, why the question?

[mattd]

Not Scripture, but this reminded me of the discussion tonight. This is the 8th resolution from Jonathan Edwards:

"Resolved, to act, in all respects, both speaking and doing, as if nobody had been so vile as I, and as if I had committed the same sins, or had the same infirmities or failings, as others, and that I will let the knowledge of their failings promote nothing but shame in myself, and prove only an occasion of my confessing my own sins and misery to God."

[Micter]

In the OT there were different levels of sin. Some demanded sacrifice of certain animals, some demanded cleansing, some demanded restitution etc. In theology they teach three types. !. Omission this is the sin of NOT doing something required. 2. Commission or perpetration which is basically a state of willfully sinning 3. Transgression which has to do more with our sin nature. The little things that we just gloss over. Paul wrote that fornication is a different level of sin as it is the only sin that one does against their own body. Even though there might be different classifications or levels of sin it really all boils down to Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength and your neighbor as yourself. If we apply these two commandments......We all know that is just about impossible. That's why we need a savior!

[stephen]

But even when it is all broken down, and even if there is an argument that one sin is greater than another, it all comes down to this:

Sin is separation from God. An act of rebellion against Him. And we all know that God has no part of sin, and will have no part of sin.

[ptrallan01]

I love MusicChad's answer. Beautiful.

[thunderbyrd]

In the OT there were different levels of sin. Some demanded sacrifice of certain animals, some demanded cleansing, some demanded restitution etc. In theology they teach three types. !. Omission this is the sin of NOT doing something required. 2. Commission or perpetration which is basically a state of willfully sinning 3. Transgression which has to do more with our sin nature. The little things that we just gloss over. Paul wrote that fornication is a different level of sin as it is the only sin that one does against their own body. Even though there might be different classifications or levels of sin it really all boils down to Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength and your neighbor as yourself. If we apply these two commandments......We all know that is just about impossible. That's why we need a savior!

thank you, Micter. there's some information here i can use.

[outhawkn]

Yes! John 19:11

Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin."

At least thats the way I read it.....

[Kitty]

This isn't really an answer; just an observation. IF there are greater and lesser sins, we still do not posses the wisdom and/or perspective to judge between them.

[outhawkn]

This isn't really an answer; just an observation. IF there are greater and lesser sins, we still do not posses the wisdom and/or perspective to judge between them.

Thurnderbyrd asked: are some sins worse than others? He didnt ask if we can understand or judge them.

Just repeating what Jesus said.......:)

[mattd]

Yes! John 19:11

Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin."

At least thats the way I read it.....


That's an interesting observation. Without knowing the context, I assume "the one who handed me over to you" is Satan and "the greater sin" is the rejection of God, which is said elsewhere to be the only unforgivable sin.

The Blue Letter Bible (http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G3187&t=KJV&page=2) also states that the word could be translated as "greatest", which could imply the greatest amount of sin, not necessarily one sin that's worse than any other.

[outhawkn]

Also "some sins on the part of Christians warrant extreme discipline on behalf of the offender, e.g., the expulsion of congregational fellowship (see 1 Corinthians 5), while other offences may require patience and further instruction (see Romans 14)."
This also would indicate to me that some sins are greater and that we do have the wisdom and resposibility to judge....Right?

[outhawkn]

That's an interesting observation. Without knowing the context, I assume "the one who handed me over to you" is Satan and "the greater sin" is the rejection of God, which is said elsewhere to be the only unforgivable sin.

The Blue Letter Bible (http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G3187&t=KJV&page=2) also states that the word could be translated as "greatest", which could imply the greatest amount of sin, not necessarily one sin that's worse than any other.

Jesus was saying that Caiaphas, the High Priest at the time who handed Jesus over to Pilate and that his sin was greater than Pilate's.

[mattd]

Jesus was saying that Caiaphas, the High Priest at the time who handed Jesus over to Pilate and that his sin was greater than Pilate's.


After reading it in context, I think it could refer to either Caiaphas or Satan. The sentence before about how power has been given to Pilate from above makes me think that Jesus is not referring to a human. Also, in the Greek it looks like the pronoun used for the word "he" is actually a neuter pronoun; if I had just looked at that sentence alone I would have translated it "this one" or "this thing." But my Greek skills are very elementary, so don't take my word for it; there might be a very good reason why the translators give a male gender pronoun. But that's just what it looks like to me...

[outhawkn]

After reading it in context, I think it could refer to either Caiaphas or Satan. The sentence before about how power has been given to Pilate from above makes me think that Jesus is not referring to a human. Also, in the Greek it looks like the pronoun used for the word "he" is actually a neuter pronoun; if I had just looked at that sentence alone I would have translated it "this one" or "this thing." But my Greek skills are very elementary, so don't take my word for it; there might be a very good reason why the translators give a male gender pronoun. But that's just what it looks like to me...

In all fairness to everyone reading my posts about doctrine. I have a different view than most...:yikes:

I believe that the Bible isnt some great mystery that man-kind cant understand or one must be a theologian to understand it. I believe that the Bible is the word of God with no exceptions and that he didnt create a list of do's and dont's that we cant understand. Its my firm belief that if you read a verse God intended for it to be understood. I believe God had the right people translate it so that if I read it and it says dont, then the answer is dont. So when I read a verse I dont need the Greek or Hebrew, or Aramaic meaning of the word. God took care of all that. I'm a simple person, and I believe God made the Bible for me to understand so i can know what his heart is and what it is he is saying.......:yeah::)

[mattd]

In all fairness to everyone reading my posts about doctrine. I have a different view than most...:yikes:

I believe that the Bible isnt some great mystery that man-kind cant understand or one must be a theologian to understand it. I believe that the Bible is the word of God with no exceptions and that he didnt create a list of do's and dont's that we cant understand. Its my firm belief that if you read a verse God intended for it to be understood. I believe God had the right people translate it so that if I read it and it says dont, then the answer is dont. So when I read a verse I dont need the Greek or Hebrew, or Aramaic meaning of the word. God took care of all that. I'm a simple person, and I believe God made the Bible for me to understand so i can know what his heart is and what it is he is saying.......:yeah::)

I would agree with you; I think what the last few posts have been about is a very small point in theology. I don't think it matters if there are greater or lesser sins, we still sin and are so far away from perfection that there's no way we could ever get there (as Chad illustrated in one of the first posts). I think there are subtleties that can be picked up by knowing the original languages because there are moods and such that cannot be translated. But the theological point of the Bible is simple enough that it can be translated and understood in any language.

[Micter]

thank you, Micter. there's some information here i can use.

My pleasure

[outhawkn]

I would agree with you; I think what the last few posts have been about is a very small point in theology. I don't think it matters if there are greater or lesser sins, we still sin and are so far away from perfection that there's no way we could ever get there (as Chad illustrated in one of the first posts). I think there are subtleties that can be picked up by knowing the original languages because there are moods and such that cannot be translated. But the theological point of the Bible is simple enough that it can be translated and understood in any language.

I agree...............:yeah:

[Kitty]

Boy, it's a good thing that my identity is not based on my posts in this forum being understood.

[Strat-tastic]

Boy, it's a good thing that my identity is not based on my posts in this forum being understood.

rofl :cool:

And they say they don't understand irony over the pond. :)

[thunderbyrd]

most people who know their Bible would answer the question "are there greater and lesser degrees of sin?" by saying "Well, sin is sin, right?" and yes, all sin is evil, all sin is destructive, and all sin requires a blood sacrifice.

but common sense tells anyone that some sins are worse than others. i could be out in the woods without another human around and utter a profane word - and that's a sin. or i could go to my job, become angry with someone for whatever reason and strike them and kill them. is the latter not a greater sin?

before answering, i recommend one compare leviticus chapters 4 and 5 to leviticus chapter 20.