Washburn HB35...

[Crunchyriff]

anybody ever play/try one? Input please. NEED input! :biggrin:

[jazzrat]

Only played one...and did not get to plug it in, but fit and finish was very good. At least as good as my Ibanez Pat Metheny. I've certainly heard good things about them on the various boards

[Micter]

I think if you buy an Epiphone Dot, gut it and change all the electronics you'll end up with a better guitar for less money.

I've played those Washburn's and wasn't really impressed. Not for the money. I think you'd end up changing the pickups anyway.

[SAguitar]

Oh, we're talkin' about a 335 style here? You mean like...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7336090942&fromMakeTrack=true

Like that?

I haven't played one, but I do have an Epi Sheraton that I totally tricked out for about that amount of money, and it's a sweet player. :cool:

[Crunchyriff]

Micter, which HB model are you referring to? (they have three: HB 30, 32 and 35) May be you played a dud, or the lower-tier model.

Sorry, but I don't want an Epi. (YMMV) Not to mention that I've heard some complaints about neck joint stability in the newer Epi clones that concern me.

The older Sheratons (70's, 80's) were great guitars.

Thanks, guys!

[dmw]

The newest Washburn HB's get mixed reviews, and, from what I've seen of them, that's deserved; However, I must admit it's been over a year since I really looked at one or had my hands on one. The very latest versions may be OK, so maybe my post is really not going to be too helpful to you. From my limited experience, I'd recommend that you first try to find a NOS made in Korea version as I think they were consistently good, either the HB-30 or HB-35.

[Crunchyriff]

dmw- thanks, and a question:

I'd recommend that you first try to find a NOS made in Korea version as I think they were consistently good, either the HB-30 or HB-35.

Are you talking about the HB35's that had the two thin dark stripes down the back of the neck like the Sheraton II's?

[Micter]

Micter, which HB model are you referring to? (they have three: HB 30, 32 and 35) May be you played a dud, or the lower-tier model.

Sorry, but I don't want an Epi. (YMMV) Not to mention that I've heard some complaints about neck joint stability in the newer Epi clones that concern me.

The older Sheratons (70's, 80's) were great guitars.

Thanks, guys!

I played the 35 and I like my Dot way better.

http://home.socal.rr.com/vlicausi/dot.jpg

[dmw]

dmw- thanks, and a question:

I'd recommend that you first try to find a NOS made in Korea version as I think they were consistently good, either the HB-30 or HB-35.

Are you talking about the HB35's that had the two thin dark stripes down the back of the neck like the Sheraton II's?

Now you're testing my memory. I believe that is correct, but I don't recall seeing the neck stripes (mahogany or other?) on the newest versions.

[Crunchyriff]

Micter- is that an Epi? I can't see the whole headstock in that shot. I LOVE that color!!!! YEAH!!! What model is that?

Tell, me, from your perspective as a player, what was it that sold you on the Epi over the HB-35? The particular guitar? Any one thing? Multiple things? Brand loyalty? I'm all ears. I understand differnt players like different things, so opinions are what they are- but still can have valuable info.

I'm jonesing for both red and natural. I have one, no two, no THREE things that are pulling me towards the HB35 that are these:

!. Percieved Cost-to-value factor. I don't mind if the electronics are crud, I plan on R&R'ing them anyway.

2. I've got big hands- HB30/35 offers substantial fretboard clearance in the upper registers.

3. I've just never seen any late Epi guitars that I could get excited about. To me, if' I'm gonna spend that much (Epi's have gone up), I might as well go the full monty and go Gibson...which I am trying to avoid.

Here's a freebie: I want the Feiten tuning system. I think it's a cool advantage.

One more question- how is the neck joint on yours?

Talk to me, bro. Thanks, Micter!

DMW- thanks!

[Micter]

Micter- is that an Epi? I can't see the whole headstock in that shot. I LOVE that color!!!! YEAH!!! What model is that?

Tell, me, from your perspective as a player, what was it that sold you on the Epi over the HB-35? The particular guitar? Any one thing? Multiple things? Brand loyalty? I'm all ears. I understand differnt players like different things, so opinions are what they are- but still can have valuable info.

I'm jonesing for both red and natural. I have one, no two, no THREE things that are pulling me towards the HB35 that are these:

!. Percieved Cost-to-value factor. I don't mind if the electronics are crud, I plan on R&R'ing them anyway.

2. I've got big hands- HB30/35 offers substantial fretboard clearance in the upper registers.

3. I've just never seen any late Epi guitars that I could get excited about. To me, if' I'm gonna spend that much (Epi's have gone up), I might as well go the full monty and go Gibson...which I am trying to avoid.

Here's a freebie: I want the Feiten tuning system. I think it's a cool advantage.

One more question- how is the neck joint on yours?

Talk to me, bro. Thanks, Micter!

DMW- thanks!

Here's how the story goes... I was looking for an ES335 (Gibson Pure!) I couldn't find a good one. All the ones I played had issues. Finish, set up, etc.. I then started looking at all of the clones I looked at Sheritans, Dots, and the Washburn Line was in the mix as well as some others like Ibanez and so on. I took them one by one into the vintage room where I could plug them in and let 'em rip. The Dot just played better and sounded better than the rest. I was shocked at how great it was even stock. Now keep in mind I bought it knowing all too well that I would be gutting it and rebuilding the entire electrical system. I put Seymour Duncan 59s Gibson pots, switchcraft input and 3 way, a bone nut and a new wiring harness.
I have about 600 bux into it and trust me it'll kill the Washburn as far as tone goes. The one thing that was just over the top is the fretwork but the finish was absolutely perfect. It was super easy to set up the g string was the only intonation problem. It took a half turn to get it intonated. It was set up better than any Gibson I looked at. You know I do the work on all my guitars and a set up is no big deal for me and I expect to have to adjust a guitar. I could have left it set up from the factory.

As far as all of your why you want the Washburn things go, I can only say mt Dot was $400 out the door an $200 worth of up grades. It plays and sounds fantastic, looks great, and wasn't very expensive either.
I have huge hands and I can play the Dot no problem. The finish on the Dots are better than most Gibsons. The Dot is the "working man's Epiphone" kind of plain Jane but gets the job done.

Price for the model one up from what I got is $379.00 at musicians friend.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/fg=141/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/518251/

The model I got is $449.00

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/fg=141/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/518250/

You should be able to get a price match on the other model which is normally more money than the stock Dot.

So let me know when you buy that Washburn? :banghead If you are set on the Washburn let me know I have a friend that is a Washburn Dealer.

[Crunchyriff]

GULP!! you may have sold me, Micter!! Thanks!
Between you and SA I might be a changin me mind, matey...

[Micter]

GULP!! you may have sold me, Micter!! Thanks!

Ha Ha! Don't get a Dot Studio model.

[dmw]

Crunchy,

I should have sold you my DeArmond (made in Korea by Cort) Starfire. It was natural finish and was made better than my original Guild Starfire. I already let it go, and I kinda wish I had it back. But I've still got my Ibanez AS-200 and I'm happy with that for a semi-hollow.

I don't want to run this into the ground or offend anybody, but I'd give you the same advice on Epi's that I gave you on Washburns. Play and look before you buy. I've seen some wonderfully made Epi Dots, especially when you consider the prices, and I've seen some that were awful, and were dead-sounding, even with USA Gibson pickups. However, a few months back I was in Guitar Cener in Indianapolis and they had some very nice flame top Epi Dots. I didn't plug one in, but I can tell you that the build quality was excellent on these.

[Micter]

DMW is 100% correct as with any guitar purchase try it before you buy it.

[Crunchyriff]

Micter- (SA too if you in da house) What kinda neck profile does that thing have...and is that Wine Red or Cherry that you have (Micter)?

Don't worry- I don't want a studio model!

[Micter]

Mine is Cherry but it looks very wine red. I like the wine red best and cherry next. Mine is sort of in between. The neck profile won't bother you Mr. Les Paul player. :lol: It's very much like a Gibson neck but just a bit slimmer. Not enough to be a problem.

[Crunchyriff]

The neck profile won't bother you Mr. Les Paul player. Laughing Har- dat be me...

As long as it isn't a 60's slim profile (or like an Ibanez Shredder neck), I'll be a happy camper. Yours looks VERY Wine Red. That is beautiful.

I'm tempted to buy one of those Wine Red "Dot Deluxe's" (thanks for the links, BTW) for the lower price than the Dot. I wonder why they are charging less... maybe they aren't moving as well as anticipated. Hmm looks like a similar bridge to the HB35... interesting.

FWIW, I had an '80 WR LP Std that was a cool guitar- probably the best Norlin-era LP I ever played... I've always liked Gibson's Wine Red color. Great color.

I'm goin' up to GC this weekend to scout out some prospects...

[Micter]

Good luck. Don't be afraid to walk out if you don't find what you're lookin' for. Some are better than others. I forgot to tell you that I had the salesman pull a new one out of the back and the one hanging on the wall sounded and played better.

[Crunchyriff]

Oh I do that kind of stuff all the time- ("got any stashed in the back?")

I won't usually "impulse buy", either. I've walked on many guitars. ( a few I wish I hadn't)

I can always have "musician's fiend" send me a few to peruse, too. 45-day return is a great thing. Unfortunately, I'll eat the shipping but it's better than eating a guitar I don't like.

Thanks Micter, DMW, etc.!!

Oh oh...I just spotted something...ohh oooohhhhh!!

[Crunchyriff]

Anybody know about the flamey ones?? GOOD, ja?

[Micter]

Well let me just say this and take it with a grain of salt. I'm so tired of flame maple tops I could just PUKE!

[Crunchyriff]

Well start blowing chunks...
:mrgreen:

Look this item #
7337875708

up on ebay (I cant get a link to work for some reason)

[Micter]

It's not bad looking but with freight at $60 I'd let that one go. It'll end up costing you more than if you bought a new one. I like the color a lot.

[Crunchyriff]

I already talked to the guy and he said he'd work with me on the freight charges (too steep) say- about 40

One of the things I'm also considering is if I buy a new one thru MF or whatever, MF (that i know of) ships the guitar and case seperately ( you buy the case extra and they ship it apart from the guitar, and you get NAILED on shipping charges) so that's also a factor I'm evaluating.

That flamey one aside (and I like it alot..the guy said the neck is between thin and medium- I dunno about that) I really would like one in the color of yours if I bought a different one. (if you don't mind)

That is just fantastic. It's somewhat reminiscent of the old, aged cherry- the color I really want, but I can't afford a 60's 335 to GET that color. Well, let me put it this way, I can afford it, but seriously can't JUSTIFY it.

[Micter]

At first glance I didn't notice the case was included. $400 BIN and $40 to ship is a great deal. I actually took the time to read the part about contacting him before July 22nd and the BINis still an option. I payed $100 for the case at GC so that puts the guitar at $300 plus shipping. Froggy says Jump!

I don't know what you would do if there was a problem with the guitar but it does look like it's a good deal.

[Crunchyriff]

extras: Stand, case, strap, 4 sets of strings and cord. have no idea what they may be. I might bite. I'm not a fan of gold hardware, but I'll probably upgrade that stuff down the road. Lots to think about here...

[Micter]

extras: Stand, case, strap, 4 sets of strings and cord. have no idea what they may be. I might bite. I'm not a fan of gold hardware, but I'll probably upgrade that stuff down the road. Lots to think about here...

I am looking at a tone pro bridge and stop bar and probably some planet waves tuners in black. I kinda like the black and red look.

[Crunchyriff]

Black and red looks very cool.

YMMV, but I had rotten luck back in the 80's wiht Black-Chrome hardware (ie, Floyds, etc) for some reason the sound was just horrid. I have no idea what they use in the black-chrome process, but I'd sure like to find out.

[Micter]

Black and red looks very cool.

YMMV, but I had rotten luck back in the 80's wiht Black-Chrome hardware (ie, Floyds, etc) for some reason the sound was just horrid. I have no idea what they use in the black-chrome process, but I'd sure like to find out.

It just so happens that I am a plater by trade. It is hexavalent Chrome with a controlled contamination that gives it that darkness. The thickness and process is exactly the same as a regular chrome finish. Usually they use zinc as the added metal that shows up as black in the chrome process. You shouldn't be able to tell any difference. Maybe you just don't like the way it looks so...... :crazy :dunno :mrgreen:

[Crunchyriff]

You shouldn't be able to tell any difference. Maybe you just don't like the way it looks so......

No nooo.... ya swizzle stick! (har!) I had a few Black Chrome Floyd Rose systems in the mid 80's and they both sounded like doggie doo... they sounded nothing like the regular chrome & gold Floyds. Maybe they changed the process over time since then.

I really like the black chrome look (I do I do!) on certain instruments, but that experience back in the 80's with the aforementioned Floyds pretty much has steered me clear since then.

[Micter]

You shouldn't be able to tell any difference. Maybe you just don't like the way it looks so......

No nooo.... ya swizzle stick! (har!) I had a few Black Chrome Floyd Rose systems in the mid 80's and they both sounded like doggie doo... they sounded nothing like the regular chrome & gold Floyds. Maybe they changed the process over time since then.

I really like the black chrome look (I do I do!) on certain instruments, but that experience back in the 80's with the aforementioned Floyds pretty much has steered me clear since then.There might have been a different block or something. I was in the plating industry since 1985. I don't know of any major changes in the Black Chrome process. I used to work for Fender's main plating supplier. I did all of the nickel, gold, chrome and black chrome for Fender guitars.

Here's a momento I got from the owner.

http://home.socal.rr.com/vlicausi/alstrat.jpg

[Crunchyriff]

That's mighty purty, Sir Micter! I have no idea if these trems had a different block or what, but I can tell you this- I know a few other guitarists that ran into the same thing during those years. Maybe just a bad production batch or something... I have no idea what else the problem could have been.

You know how a typical "floyd" has it's own sound, right? (which I don't care for anyway) these black trems were at the opposite end of the spectrum. Dark, dead, and ugly sounding. We're talking manure pile ugly. Not 'musical' at all. Yuck. That's one thing I like about my Tom Anderson guitars with the Kahler licensed "floyd" ("steeler" IIRC)- they don't sound like a guitar with a "Floyd"; they sound uhh, for lack of a better term, normal.

[Crunchyriff]

The guy with the flame "dot" emailed me this am and made me an even better offer.

Froggy- I'm jumpin! I'll keep ya posted!

[Crunchyriff]

YESS!!! I scored!! heh-he huheheh...

I got a better deal than what the auction shows, and better than what I told you yesterday, Micter. yeaHHHH!

390+ 30 bucks for 2 day shipping (he's splitting the cost of shipping with me)

Ya can't beat that with a dead rat....

[Crunchyriff]

The guitar arrived today. I have some definite first impressions, but will wait a day or two (or three) before I comment further.

"This and more to come..."

[Pearly Gator]

Congratulations on the new arrival, Crunchy! Post some pictures when you can.

Later,

Gator

[Micter]

The guitar arrived today. I have some definite first impressions, but will wait a day or two (or three) before I comment further.

"This and more to come..."

C'mon! Comment already!

[Crunchyriff]

C'mon! Comment already!

HAR!! "Sorrry Charlie..." :biggrin:

I'll get some decent pics up asap...

[Micter]

http://www.lpmusic.com/Product_Showcase/Cowbells/images/LP229-mamboCowbell.jpg

[Crunchyriff]

OH man..you KNOW I can't resist DA COWBELL!!

mooooo!

[Pearly Gator]

Being sensitive to everyone's need for eye candy, here's a shot of my 335 clone. It's the discontinued blueburst, Ibanez Artcore AS73. The pickups were swapped out for Schaller Golden 59s. This guitar has excellent upper fret access.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/064a.jpg

Gator

[Crunchyriff]

Yeah, very cool. Looks like the same style cutaways as on the HB30, and 35's.

[Micter]

OH man..you KNOW I can't resist DA COWBELL!!

mooooo!

\:D/

[Crunchyriff]

Okay, here we go...

This is after a few hours of play and 3 days after the delivery.

Pros:
The guitar is near-mint. So is the Epi HSC. Very little wear or use. Appears the owner had a roland GK p'up sys on it and still has a bit of foam adhesive I need to remove between the bridge and p'up.

The build quality indeed is VERY nice for the price point. Flame-top (probably photo-flame..I dunno), VERY plain & opaque back and sides.

The neck has some depth to it- not a "thin" profile.

All in all a well-put together axe. Decent tuners and hardware.

Cons:

1. Teeny frets.

2. Crappy electronics, including the ubiquitous import toggle with crud in it.

3. Though the guitar has a decent acoustic tone, it doesn't transmit that quality well through the pickups (see #2)

4. I don't like the Epiphone headstock. (an aesthetic issue for sure, but still one for me that I could overlook if other issues didn't factor in )

5. The Fretboard feels, for lack of a better word, "synthetic".

6. Lacks the woody tone I'd expect out of a 335 axe. (see #2)

7. Probable photo-flame (not real) top.

8. (and this is a big one for me) Next to the small frets & fretboard "feel", the fretboard width itself bothers me. It's almost as narrow as an EVH music man. At least that's how it feels to me.

Conclusion:

I'm used to both boutique, Standard production AND import guitars ( I just sold two Hamer korean Imports within the last year along with my Hamer USA and others) and all points between; so I think I can make an objective call here. I WANT to like this guitar. It has many good points- build quality is one of them. It's beautiful, solid, and evokes confidence when strapped on for duty. The neck is VERY stable. Holds tune well, and needs just a bit of setup work to quell a few buzzes.

That being said, I am also looking at what it might take to bring it up to what I would call "acceptable" for me personally- ie, something I could live with for awhile. Remember, this is coming from a (forgive me) pro player with over three decades of music behind me and more guitars than I care to count that I've owned over the years- I've come away with definite tastes. likes and dislikes.

For the beginner, intermediate or advanced player, or perhaps the pro player who digs a bit narrow but not thin neck- this might well be the ticket. Much is in the eye of the beholder. I would need a tad wider fretboard, bigger frets, and all new electronics to make it happen, but I still don't like the feel of the fretboard itself. BOTH My Korean Hamer imports had way better necks and fretboards, for instance, at the same price point as this guitar. Somebody else may love it and think I've been smoking crack.

Two out of four of those issues could be solved, but for the $$ upcharge it would take to do it, for a few bucks more I think I can do better with a ES-333, Orville by Gibson, Tokai, etc.

This one will most likely go bye-bye. It's probably just not for me.
Final decision will be at weeks-end. (90% certainty it will be sold)

[Micter]

Dude

That is such a crack up. You really hate it that much? The Washburn would be worse but that's a gimme. I'm sure you can turn a profit on the guitar so It isn't that big of a deal. You seem to be the kind of guy that should play a guitar before you buy it. Sorry that it didn't work out for you but I'm gonna stick to my guns...My Dot kicks major butt!

[Crunchyriff]

Bro Micter, I love entertaining (har!)...I never said I hated it. That's quite a misrepresentation of what I said in my review. WHY is that such a crack-up to you? Because I don't see eye to eye with your findings? Do you know how that sounds? Easy on the old Crunchy... (!!) Whoa Micter, Whoa!!

:popcorn

I'm not cracking up because you like yours, nor do I feel the need to fall in lock step with a 'collective' mindset here. I have my own likes and, look, I don't care who thinks I'm crazy, or dead-on for that matter; I'm the one who ultimately has to play the guitars I buy.(play, strangle, mutilate, etc..)

It ain't speakin to me, bro!!

I'm being realistic, honest and pretty neutral- just callin' it as I see it, and have nothing to gain either way; in fact I'd have more to gain by blowing smoke and flower buds with glowing praise because I already bought it.

I'm glad YOUR Dot "kicks major butt" Micter. You might well like this one, too. Like I said, it has much going for it-it's a great guitar...just not for ME. Then again, your DOT may not be my cup of tea, either. Everybody isn't wired the same way, like the same things, or listen/look for exactly the same thing/ nor look at things the same way. It almost sounds like a "mine is good because I like it" thing & that's rather academic.

I'm not sure the Washburn would be that much worse-(nor do I expect them to eclipse the Dot) remember you yourself, as other have said, that the DOT's vary widely, and I quote you "you gotta play one before you buy it...don't buy before you play it." ( remember that? :dunno )

That really is a 'given' with most guitars, as you should well know. They aren't cookie cutter, even the top end guitars aren't. I knew I was taking a chance, and like you said, I can turn it and not lose a dime.

Again, my main point was- to get this thing road-ready to my satisfaction, I'd probably spend, well, not including a refret, about 200 bucks, so we are already well over 600+, (and still have a narrow neck) and for just a few hundred more I can get a WAY better guitar, at least one more suited for what I like, want, and fits me. (no I'm not talking about a Washburn)

I call that good stewardship, actually. Nothing to crack up about there!

Like I said the jury is still out 'till the weekend, but it doesn't look like it's the right one..

Now back to our normally scheduled show....

G'Nite, Micter!
"zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz..."

[MrMike]

One thing I've found about the Epi's is that there is quite a bit of variation from one to the next. I played 2 otherwise identical Dots here locally; one felt REALLY cheesy (rough fingerboard, sharp frets, scrawny neck) while the other felt great.

[Micter]

Crunch

I was just funnin' I'm really bummed because I sort of sold you on the DOT. But! I still think you need to hit all of your area music stores and find a guitar that you really like. I play Gibson V's do you know how many people give me crap for that? Mic how can you play those stink'n V's? They're so uncomfortable! Blah Blah Blah But I still play 'em cuz that's what I like. I understand if you don't like a guitar. Geez, how many guitars have I looked at and thought negatively about?

I think you totally read my post different than I intended it. I think after all these years you know me enough that I wasn't trying to rub it in your face as much as I was trying to make light of a sort of bad situation. Again I still think you can make a profit off of that guitar. I saw one in a local used music store that had a price tag of $399. This one wasn't in very good shape IMO.

Good luck

[Crunchyriff]

Micter, I'm just slinging it back at ya, bro! No offense taken or intended. I honestly couldn't figure out what cracked you up, though. Guess because I'm just another one of those weird musicians.. (like YOU!!)

The guitar is actually a very nice guitar. VERY nice, and somewhat better than I expected from a non-elite Epi. It just has some things (as above) that just don't add up for me. But it IS still a cool ride.

Vees? You play those steeenking VEEES?? (rofl!!) Actually, when played like MS with the lower wing anchored between the knees, not only is it the most stable 6-string electric platform, but fret access is effortless all the way up the neck, as you well know. (I've had two Rocket Roll SR's, and a Gibson '58 Korina reissue)

I love 'em, and will have another someday...probably.

[Micter]

Micter, I'm just slinging it back at ya, bro! No offense taken or intended. I honestly couldn't figure out what cracked you up, though. Guess because I'm just another one of those weird musicians.. (like YOU!!)

.

C'mon you like me? LMBO! Exactly!

And I was cracking up because we like a lot of the same gear and feel of guitars so I thought the Dot wouldn't be an issue for you. I was soooooo wrong. Oh well, Life goes on.

[Crunchyriff]

DUH!!

:banghead :mrgreen:


Actually, I'll blame both you AND SA for this little escapade! (har!!)

[Crunchyriff]

Mods should be happy with my @280x400 file size! It is an "Epi Dot Flame Deluxe", & it would pass for a new guitar in the rack.

http://www.lilypix.com/photos/data/069d3bb002acd8d7dd095917f9efe4cb/2079_p47958.jpg

http://www.lilypix.com/photos/data/069d3bb002acd8d7dd095917f9efe4cb/2079_p47959.jpg

http://www.lilypix.com/photos/data/069d3bb002acd8d7dd095917f9efe4cb/2079_p47960.jpg

[Micter]

Geez that is one purdy guitar. OK I'll stop, I promise! 8-[

[Crunchyriff]

Ya swizzle stick!! :mrgreen:

[Micter]

Ya swizzle stick!! :mrgreen: :oops:

[Crunchyriff]

Har! Yer blushing, Micter!!

[dmw]

That Dot "looks" like it should sound nice. Looks aren't everything, I suppose.

Speaking of looks, I kinda like the look of this:

http://www.rondomusic.net/photos/electric/as8201.jpg

[Crunchyriff]

DMW- this dot sounds great acoustically (always a good sign), and will probably be a stunner with some good pickups. I'm not selling it for its lack of tonal potential- it's all there.

It doesn't sound "bad" the way it is; it's more or less just what you'd expect from these kind of import pickups...just a generic hash. Good pots, caps and p'ups will cure that real quick.

One more plus is its weight. @ about 8.5 lbs, (roughly about the same weight as my Historic '58 LP) it's definitely one of the lighter 335's/clones/355's etc that I've played in the past. Some of these guitars are unmercifully heavy.

Agile makes a great guitar for the price. That one looks an awful lot like the Carvin SH-225 they used to make in the early 80's. If I weren't so set on the 335 format, I'd spring for one of those- in fact I almost did before they changed the body shape to keep Gibson off their tails. (the 335 shape they had before)

Anyway, could I make this guitar work for me? Certainly- without question. My hands just don't gravitate towards this particular neck (and it's a REAL good one- just not what I'm looking for). Put it this way: Gibson has about 3 main different neck profiles they are commonly known for, with variances in all three. (std, 60's taper, 50s taper) Then you have the historics' profiles which fall between baseball bat (57-58), fat-comfy medium (59) and slim-taper 60's. (of course, with variances in those)

The avg experienced Gibson player that has more understanding of necks than the current tongue-depressor 60's slim taper fare might think this is one of the best feeling necks ever. I was quite shocked when I pulled it out of the case. I would call it medium, but a svelte medium, with a tad narrower fretboard like on some V's I've come across.

So I'm being VERY picky because the neck is a non-swappable item, and ya can't add to what's not there already. I want just a bit more girth at the neck shoulders and the width of the fretboard, and I just don't like the headstock.

[dmw]

An Epi Dot I played one time was awfully narrow at the nut, too. Another one was not. Lots of variance in those, and I don't understand why if they're building from prints and specs, and using automated equipement in the same factory.

BTW, those Carvins were actually Hofner guitars with Carvin electronics, and a Carvin factory setup. You can still buy those Hofners, but they're all priced in the Gibson range or higher. This Agile pictured in the previous post is a scaled-down body (ala Gibson 336), and not standard size. It's hard to detect that in this picture. I wouldn't like that slim taper neck on that type of guitar either.

[Crunchyriff]

DMW- actually the nut width is not the problem, as it's standard Gibby width.

It's more like the area, say, from the 5th fret on up that seems a bit narrow. Hard to explain (with my extremely limited vocabulary..) Like I said, I've played some Gibby V's that felt this way too, so it's not an uncommon thing.

I'm probably just a weirdo.

Yopu know, after you bringing it up and me looking again, no that Agile is NOT a 335 size guitar, more like the Malcom Young Gretsch or as you said, the 336- something like that, huh?

[SAguitar]

Youse guys both quack me up! Whaaahahahahahaaaa!

Sorry it ain't workin' out for ya, Crunchy! I know what ya mean about a guitar not speakin' to ya. I probably couldn't tell ya how many guitars I've bought off of Ebay in the last five years and resold shortly later because I didn't bond with them. I always spend several hours cleaning them up first, and doing a good setup on them before I'll start making final decisions, but if you don't feel that spark at the beginning of the process, it likely ain't gonna make the cut.

At least you shouldn't lose any dough in the process. I did spend a few bucks on replacing all the electronics in my Sheraton, a graphite nut, and new tuners, so I'm probably about $500 into it now. I also had to dress all the frets, and smooth out the ends of some of them, so it was sort of a diamond in the rough. I did love the feel of the neck from the beginning, though, and that is a huge factor in my keep-it-or-dump-it decision. :cool:

Better luck next time! \:D/ :lol:

[Pearly Gator]

Crunchy man,

This is late in coming but I expect to be able to give you that Washburn HB35 review you asked for. Mrs. Gator just approved this for my birthday...

http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/hollowbody_hb35n.jpg

A few weeks ago, I got to test drive an HB30 in sunburst. Though made in China, the neck, frets and tone were most excellent for blues and jazz. Even Mrs. G commented on it. Searching locally and on the Internet, everyone is out of Washburn thirties and thirty fives. Add to that, the prices went up July 1, 2006. I found one at Pulse Music in Indiana for last year's price. Ordering sight unseen is against my policy so this will be a first.

Review to follow....

PG

[Crunchyriff]

Eagerly awaiting the review, bro!! :-)

[SAguitar]

Right on! And happy birthday, Stephen! :grin:

[Pearly Gator]

Fedex ruined the guitar. I got home today, just in time for delivery. The neck is cracked and the fretboard is separating at the first fret. This was my first online "guitar" purchase in 42 years of playing and by-crikey it's the last. It's also my last-ever dealing with Fedex.

:evil:

[Crunchyriff]

Fedex ruined the guitar. I got home today, just in time for delivery. The neck is cracked and the fretboard is separating at the first fret. This was my first online "guitar" purchase in 42 years of playing and by-crikey it's the last. It's also my last-ever dealing with Fedex.

:evil:

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Man I'm sorry to hear that, PG.

I've heard it said before..."ya think UPS is bad, try Fed Ex..." I hear their ( Fed Ex) damage claims procedures are a farce.

That being said, when I ship a guitar, (ie when I purchase one for ME) I usually ship it to me via overnight, or 2-day air, FeEx. The less time they have it, the less time they have to ruin it. Pricey? YES. But worth every penny. If I spend $1k or over for a guitar, it's shipped "air", period.

Now my Tokai NES-120 I had shipped UPS ground, IIRC ( in full pucker, mind you) from Canada and it arrived A-OK. Nope it wasn't ground...I think it was 2nd day air on that one.

I've shipped about 5 guitars TO me, and about the same out to different buyers- USUALLY I use air, but the lower-priced ones the buyers want UPS ground, so that's what they get.

Bummer, PG.

[Pearly Gator]

Thanks, Crunchy. THis may be an expensive lesson for me. I've filed a Fedex claim and notified the seller/store. Since I used a credit card to buy it, can VISA offer me any hope?

PG

[Crunchyriff]

Thanks, Crunchy. THis may be an expensive lesson for me. I've filed a Fedex claim and notified the seller/store. Since I used a credit card to buy it, can VISA offer me any hope?

PG

Yes, I would think so, depending on the CC Company. I'd check into it.

[SeanB]

Very Sorry to hear this one man. What a drag. But I think you may be correct on the Visa thing as well. Fedex should be fully re-imbersing on this though.

[SAguitar]

SuperBummer, Dude! Dang, that is ugly. You will have a lot of stoopid hoops to jump through, but with perseverance you'll get through. Hang tough. :cool:

[jono007]

dudes... warning about Fedex... I would only trust UPS or perhaps DHL if it's in your part of the world...

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81485&page=1&pp=15

All the best for the claim!

[dmock66]

PG - I'm VERY sorry to hear about the guitar being ruined in shipping. That's so sad. I hope your resolution is a good one when the dust finally settles.

[SAguitar]

dudes... warning about Fedex... I would only trust UPS or perhaps DHL if it's in your part of the world...

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81485&page=1&pp=15

All the best for the claim!

WOW, now that one is a really huge calamity. :cry:

[Pearly Gator]

Exhibit A, B, C and D. :(

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Fedex/072006003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Fedex/072006005.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Fedex/072006006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Fedex/072006007.jpg

[jono007]

do keep us informed on how things go. As someone said, you just need to keep hounding them and speaking to the supervisor.

All the best.

[SAguitar]

Really Gator, persevere. It could work out for good, but the process will be a struggle. I've only had one claim with Fedex, and they ended up winning. It was only a small value, around $40.00, and they kept throwing paperwork at me and requesting more photos, including pictures of the original packing, which I didn't have any more, and form after form. In the end, I finally gave up. The $40.00 was not worth all that time and effort to me. They just lost my business for good.

Best wishes to you,
Stan

[Crunchyriff]

Really Gator, persevere. It could work out for good, but the process will be a struggle. I've only had one claim with Fedex, and they ended up winning. It was only a small value, around $40.00, and they kept throwing paperwork at me and requesting more photos, including pictures of the original packing, which I didn't have any more, and form after form. In the end, I finally gave up. The $40.00 was not worth all that time and effort to me. They just lost my business for good.

Best wishes to you,
Stan

That's the game they play every time. They wear you out. They WANT you to give up. Tell them your attorney will be in touch with them- give them his or her ph. number...and watch them backpedal....

[jony]

And keep taking photos odf everything... pretend you're CSI now.

Its alot of money there.. Its worth the effort!

You'd already feel the same..

All the best with the claim.. You deserve the $ back.

[Pearly Gator]

The replacement arrived. I let the store talk me into buying a hardshell case to ship it in. This time it survived FEDEX.

The fretwork and guitar is generally pretty good. It sounds warm and jazzy plugged in. The neck is meaty, comfortable to play the jumbo frets and the rosewood feels great. Action is very low. It's a very pretty guitar. The case is a departure from the molded Washboard, er... Washburn case. This is a plywood case with five latches. The locking latch has a propensity to lock itself after riding in the trunk of my car. So, I have to keep the key handy.

Okay, on to the cons. There are a few small dark spots under the finish on the side of the neck. Filler is used on a couple of binding gaps and there is a small stain in the finish near the heal. There is filler around the fretboard inlays and the fret ends were sharp. The OEM Vinchi strings were horrid. Is the guitar worth the $450? Yes, as a $450 Chinese import guitar. I would not pay more than that for it. It is better than my Ibanez AS73 because the upper fret access is superior, the pickups sound better and the huge frets rule. I do wish the guitar were a little brighter, tone wise. The shades of gold is different between the pickups, tuners, tune-o-matic and stop bar. This is likely due to plating thickness differences.

So, my complaints boil down to minor finish issues that cannot be seen six feet away or in the photos below. I've already fixed the fret ends, changed the strings and set the intonation. Tuning is very solid and the guitar has good resonance.

The pickups are a little microphonic, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. With a sensitive PUP, a lot of the guitars physical resonance is carried through. It works good with an overdrive pedal for blues but I don't think it would be useable with a lot of high gain. It squeals with a Boss DS-1 engaged.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars005.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars009.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars010.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars011.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v630/pearlygator/Guitars/Guitars012.jpg

PG

[SAguitar]

All right, Gator! It finally worked out! That's more like the review I was expecting weeks ago. I'm real glad they stood behind it and replaced it without too much hassle for ya. It is a very pretty guitar! Sounds like one you might be proud to own and play. I've had to clean up fret ends on Asian guitar like that before, and it's not too hard to do. Maybe somewhere down the road you might want to swap out the pups, but I'm glad it's a decent already. The difference in the plating colors could be that they are getting the different parts from many different mini-factories which is common practice over there.

Stay tuned,
Stan

[Crunchyriff]

Nice bang for the buck, PG!!

Very cool.

[Pearly Gator]

Last night, I got the HB35 dialed in. It's amazing what some pickup adjusting will do. With them raised up and the screws flush, it dry & warm as would be expected. Lowering the pickups and raising the poles made it bright and Gretsch like. I went for "in between" the two.

The volume controls are wired like a Gretsch in that the pickup hot lead is wired to the pot wiper. This allows for some fancy pickup mixing in a non-traditinal, but cool way.

The factory Davinci strings were bad. I found this guitar likes Ernie Ball Slinkys. I installed a gold Gotoh aluminum stop bar tailpiece from Stewart MacDonald. Yeah, baby! The guitar is open, 3D, lively, woody and all those other things that make up a good guitar.

I dressed the fret ends and polished them with 0000 steel wool and the guitar is now everything I hoped it would be. A little more work than I wanted to do but, I will be playing it the next time my worship team is on.

In Christ,

PG

[dmock66]

That's SWEET PG!!! It's awesome how God rewards the patient, isn't it? My experience in walking with Christ is that nearly everything is more work than I wanted to do but also a greater reward than I ever expected! It's cool how a guitar can show us the same lesson.

Be blessed Gary! Play that sweet guitar for an audience of ONE!

David

[SAguitar]

Right on, Pearly! I'm so glad you're happy with the purchase. Those imports usually do take a little finetooth tweaking and setting up to bring out all they have, but it's worth it in the end! :cool:

[Pearly Gator]

This Washburn saga started in July. Well, it got it's first opportunity to "speak" at worship this weeked. The setup was HB35> Boss SD1 w/ Allums mods > Boss DS-1 w/FuzzCentral Mods > Boss CS-1 > Boss DD-5 > Fender M80 1X12 SS combo. The worship set was;

MAJESTIC (Lincoln Brewster) w/country-esque guitar fills
YOU ARE GOOD (Israel Houghton) O.D. on mid section & ending
YOUR NAME (Paul Baloche) w/soaring solo awash in chorus, delay & dist.
HOW DEEP THE FATHER'S LOVE (Stewart Townsend) Clean arpeggios w/ delay & chorus
BREAK THROUGH (Tommy Walker) chorused rhythm.

The Washburn worked very nicely. The guitarist from the other WT said it was clear and clean, yet fat. I felt it was a Gretsch-y tone. Again, the only mods were an aluminum stop bar, setup and Ernie Ball Slinkys.

PG

[SAguitar]

Excellent! I'm glad it's workin' out for ya! :grin: