Anyone Unhappy With The Taylor Expression System?

[refin]

I've had my GC-4 for almost 3 years--it is a wonderful instrument.However,I'm not real impressed with the Expression pickup system.It's hissy,even with a new battery and proper low impedence signal
.I notice it more when recording.The older Taylors with the standard under saddle pickup and side-mounted preamp sound so much better to me.Anyone else have this problem? I love the guitar,just not the Expression!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v229/refin/GC41.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v229/refin/GC4back.jpg

[MrMike]

Yup. I suppose I can live with the hiss, but the tone drives me nuts. There's a nasty honk in the midrange that I can't get rid of. I have a 30th anniversary 314 that was a gift from my brother. Love the playability and the acoustic tone, but the ES doesn't live up to the hype, IMO.

[refin]

It's a great concept,but I agree about the mid hump...........yech!
Of course,I could buy Taylor's $400-500 preamp to solve it :roll:.
The sad thing is that the Espression System was concieved by Rupert Neve!

[Crunchyriff]

If you run that thing thru a LR Baggs PADI, that should take care of the mid-hump if dialed accordingly. When I borrow my Sr Pastor's Taylors and run them thru my PADI they sound great. If it weren't for the PADI though, the expression system would drive me nuts.
I haven't had them in a recording session, so I can't speak to the hiss issue you seem to be dealing with.
I wish they offered a few different systems. But I gotta say, score the PADI and see what you think. You might be surprised as far as overall tone.

[Ascension]

I have played them in the shops and thought the tones stunk.
I have used a LR Baggs Paracoustic with both my old late 80's Takamine with only bass and Treble and the Carvin DC 400 and AE 185 I had. I awas able to get a solid tone with all of them using the Paracoustic.

[refin]

Thanks for the replies,guys.
I think it is sad to spend so much money on a guitar and have the pickup system suck.

[Brian]

If you aren't using an amp with a LOW Z input you're losing half of the sound. Have you tried with a balanced 1/4" to a XLR into a PA? Recommended that to a kid a church and it makes a phenomenal difference. Go here --> http://www.rivera.com/video.php and watch the Sedona Training Video to hear an example of the difference

[LesStrat]

3 worship leaders with 3 different Taylor's have used them in our church for years without that problem. All went from the guitar into a passive direct box direct to the PA.

Taylor-->direct box-->PA

Ranging from a 314 and up.

I only have the 110E, so I have no direct experience with the expression system (other than tinkering).

[Teleguy]

In my experience any piezo equipped acoustic electric can sound wonderful or HORRIBLE depending on a few factors.

I have a Carvin CL-450, nylon string acoustic/electric that depending on the amp and the processing, can sound as authentic and beautiful or everything bad you can expect from such a design.

Through the right rig, I could ask for nothing better.

But through my RocPro1000 head, even doctored with a Sonic Maximizer and EQ'ing, it is stone DREADFUL!

Not the guitar's fault.

[refin]

If you aren't using an amp with a LOW Z input you're losing half of the sound. Have you tried with a balanced 1/4" to a XLR into a PA? Recommended that to a kid a church and it makes a phenomenal difference. Go here --> http://www.rivera.com/video.php and watch the Sedona Training Video to hear an example of the difference

Right into PAs or a home recording mixer,all low Z.I use the low Z cable provided by Taylor.
I wish they would have spent more time on the design.........maybe the Expression System pickups with a traditional preamp.
Hard to believe that Rupert Neve (creator of all those incredible Neve consoles) designed this system.

[scooteraz]

...Hard to believe that Rupert Neve (creator of all those incredible Neve consoles) designed this system.

A sensor is a different thing to design than amplification electronics. Isn't this the system that has the three pickups, two under the soundboard and one under the neck, not really a piezo? If I recall correctly, they sort of have a free mass that isn't supposed to move, and the sound board/neck motion causes an armature to move in a magnetic field, which provides the raw signal.

Don't know if that raw signal would really be easier to process than the normal piezo.

[Crunchyriff]

I really thought the Fishman Ellipse Aura system in my Martin XC1T was far superior to the Taylor's in overall tone & sound quality. No comparison. ( and the Taylors I'm talking about cost 3-4x the price of my former Martin)

[Brian]

Right into PAs or a home recording mixer,all low Z. I use the low Z cable provided by Taylor....Sorry, I had to ask. I do like after market systrems like K&K Onboard Trinity better than the Expression System.

[refin]

I will eventually purchase an outboard preamp,but it's strange to pay so much for a guitar and have to spend MORE to make it sound right.
I still think the Neve sensors with a nice Fishman preamp would rock.

[Crunchyriff]

I will eventually purchase an outboard preamp,but it's strange to pay so much for a guitar and have to spend MORE to make it sound right.
I still think the Neve sensors with a nice Fishman preamp would rock.

That might be a hot ticket, Refin. I dunno. Those Neve sensors may not be showing their best face as-is, in the Taylor system.

I really liked the piezo/boom condenser mic combination in my Martin. Brian's K&K system also intrigues me.
You know that the bottom line is, "if it sounds good, it IS good!".

[refin]

All I know is that mic'ed up,the Taylor is stupid good.I purposely chose the smaller bodied GC-4 over the normal full dreadnaught.I did buy the wife a limited edition Autumn Series 414 Series.
This recording is actually the guitar pickup and mic blended----do you hear some hiss?
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=330460&songID=6058033

[Brian]

I will eventually purchase an outboard preamp,but it's strange to pay so much for a guitar and have to spend MORE to make it sound right.
I still think the Neve sensors with a nice Fishman preamp would rock.The preamp will need to have a low impedance input. Are the Baggs' and others' inputs unbalanced?

[refin]

Not sure.......I guess I'll get a rack mount unit of some sort.

[AaronG]

The magnetic part of the equation is what doesn't work so well. Unsersaddles have came so far. I put an Matrix Infinity in my GA3-12 and run it through an Aura. Wow! By the way, That GA4 is one fantastic looking guitar! I think I might need one of those.