Reading problem?

[seagullplayer]

Seems like no matter how long I work on a song, I have to have the words and chords on paper infront of me when I'm playing it. I know sometimes I may not even look at the paper, or just a glance now and then, but without it, I wouldn't even know where to start. Anyone have any wisdom on this? I would love to be able to break this habit. I see some guys that can play about any song they know and never look at anything. What's the secret?

BTW; I have already tried green tea, so don't go there. :-)

[MrMike]

I've found that, for me, it's a matter of getting to know the chords and how they relate to each other. For example, if the song is in G, then it goes to C, I'm thinking about the fact that we're going to the iv chord, and so on. It helps me to really know the song from the inside out, rather than knowing the chords. It's also really handy when the organist suddenly says, "We're gonna do this in Eb today." When you understand how the chords fit together, moving them around comes pretty quickly.

[kewlpack]

Ya - theory will help you a lot in thinking about "where do I go next" in a song.

It's also a bit like memorizing Scripture... break it down into easy phrases, then as you nail down each phrase, add the next, then the next, then the next... always start from the beginning as you add each phrase. By the time you have the last phrase, you've burned the first parts into your memory very nicely.

In Bible College my roommates and I (we had three plus my wife) would quote our memory verses out loud in our translation of choice to make sure we had all of our shalls/thous/and wheretofores in the right place! :crazy :crazy It was wild to hear Romans 12:1-3 in KJV, NIV, and NASB all at the same time! :popcorn

Playing music is really no different than memorizing a Bible verse - much easier even, once you have the basic theory down. Let me babble... (/me puts on theory hat)

Get your key... (C here for simplicity's sake - without any key changes mid-song)... Learn the notes and core chords in the key. When you know what notes (and chords) are in the key of C, you have 98% of your song - leads and bridges included:

Bear with me - you may already know this - in the key of C, you have:

1........2........3..........4.......5........6... ......7............1
C.......D-.......E-........F........G.......A-........Bdim......C
M.......m.......m.........M.......M.......m....... ..dim........M

(Numbers are intervals; '-' means minor chord (m), 'dim' means diminished chord, 'M' is major chord); there are no sharps or flats in C. Happy happy. :mrgreen:

If your song is in C, and starts on the C, then moves to F, then G, then C... you have a 1/4/5 progression song... the Chorus

One song that comes to mind is "Oh, Holy Night", the Christmas song. It can be played in C just like this. The progression floats around a little but dwells on 1/4/5 for the most part.

To learn 75% of the song in question - just learn the Stanza/Verse and Chorus... those two pieces will be the foundation of the song (usually). All that is left is the Bridge of the song (if it has one), the lead/solo, and rhythm under the solo.

Generally speaking, the rhythm under the solo will be a 2-chord variation of the Chorus. That, or it will cycle through a Verse/Chorus progression completely. The rules are pretty flexible as far as what the chord changes are and how long you hold each one.

The Chorus for O, Holy Night goes into the minor chords which creates this nice tension with 3/6/2 (Em, Am, Dm) (don't have my guitar in front of me so the progression may not be 3/6/2 but it WILL be those chords) - and then resolves back into the 1/4/5 (C, F, G)...and it keeps building.

Doing lead work isn't easy - but it is easier to know "where to go" because ALL of your notes will be from the key (so, in C - CDEFGABC are all good notes! Throw in a chromatic/flat/sharp here and there and you got some nice mojo going on). Remember that your NATURAL MINOR is the 6th and you can use a pentatonic/minor/dorian/aoelian scale to solo with...

So in C, your Natural Minor/6th is A minor (Tip: when playing major chord, just move back 4 frets - counting the one you are on - bingo, you are at your natural minor/6th). Because you know your theory, you can jump into a solo with pentatonic/minor/dorian/aoelian scales and it will ROCK! You can move the scale around as the chords move, but you don't HAVE to - all of the notes you are playing are in the key so it should work fine. There are times to break the rules, as always - don't worry about them at this point.

You can also build great solos by basing them on arpeggiations of alternate phrasings of the chords! Learn all the phrasings of your chords up and down the fretboard!

Bridges are usually really simple (well, ones that I've played or heard...) and rely on one or two chords in the key... I think the 2nd and 4th can work here because they are "unresolved" and lead the ear to the resolving chord... a 1st or 5th chord.

Lots and lots of songs use that technique. There are always exceptions and little variations which are what make the songs unique. For most of us and the simpler arrangements in church, you can follow the guideline that knowing the Verse/Chorus will give you almost everything you need for most songs.

Okay - that's just a little theory here and there for you to use as guidelines. Grab a song and analyze it with these ideas. Grab another one... get used to breaking them down into small chunks - then cumulatively build it up by memorizing each part together with previous parts. Memorize part 1, then part 1 & 2, then part 1 & 2 & 3, then...etc.

Once you are used to the theory behind a song, you can pick it up pretty quickly even by ear. You will begin to hear the intervals in the song and say, "hey, that's a 1/4/5 3/6/2/1 song!!" So it begins to get much easier to know where the chords are going and more importantly: where your fingers need to go next!

I like having my chord sheets handy (in my notebook) when I play. I like to have everything we are going to play in the set in order and ready to flip to. I'm not in Van Halen or in front of 70,000 fans... so it isn't a big deal. :)

Still, if you want to get away from the chord sheets - play the song until your fingers turn purple and you can't stand to hear it anymore! To the point you think "ya ya ya... alright already - I know I know..." I cannot stress enough that you make time to practice each song thoroughly. If you have rough areas - figure out what you're having trouble with, reposition yourself and try it again from the beginning of the section. It won't do you any good to blaze through the glitches ... you won't improve that way and are encouraging bad habits to set into your muscle memory.

Understand the theory in the song so it makes sense to you... and so you can do "special stuff" that fits right into it when you are inspired to (fills, licks, extended improvs, etc.). You will find it easier to create your own songs too - even if you base them on some of these that you analyze.

Whew - okay shutting up now. These are general rules of thumb. I'm not a master at all of it either. That takes time. But I know it works when you stop and go through the process.

Hope this helps bro.

[stephen]

I'm like you sgp, I know it, but once it aint in front of me my mind goes 'duhhhh', and I just stand there. But when it is there, I dont look at it :nevem: . Go figure.

I saw a "By request" show with David Bowie, and he is the same way: he's gotta have his book, or his mind goes blank on the song!

[seagullplayer]

WoW Kewlpack!
Thanks for taking the time for that answer. I'm going to study over it some more. I think I understand where your coming from on some of it. I'm no guitarist, just a guy that plays guitar. I know the basic chords in some keys, the few I can play in, but that's about where it ends.
I think your answer may be able to help me when I'm trying to figure a song out by ear, but I would have to learn alot to remember a little otherwise.
It may just be time to take a few lessons? I have an uncle that would be willing, it's just hard for me to get there regular.

[Teleguy]

Try to memorize a few songs until you've got 'em so down that a bomb could go off and not faze you.
When playing live just tell yourself, "It's ok to feel nervous, but it doesn't have to affect my playing."

Most songs have similiar structures. Pretty soon you'll have seen it all before.

Once I can remember the first word in a line of a song, the rest of that verse will flow out by itself.

I'm terribly addicted to reading everything myself. It takes extra effort of concentrate on memorization. I have to repeat verses to myself while at work or when driving, etc.

[kewlpack]

Hey no problem at all - what Teleguy says is also great insight for you... TONS of songs use the same basic progressions with only variations in rhythm, melody lines, and flourishes.

It's so funny, it is almost sick - but at church in the Kid's P&W band I'm in, the singers LOVE the key of D. So about 75% of our song catalog I've chorded out in variations of D, G, C, A, and Bm chords - most songs we play stick to those chords (in various progressions).

It's funny because they say - "Hey Alex - can you play [NAMEOFSONG]?" To which I reply... "hmmm, sing it for me and I'll see if I can figure it out." At the same time I move to D! Most of the time that's the starting chord! :ROFL :ROFL

I would recommend taking some lessons but don't spend a bazillion bucks on them unless you have the budget and KNOW the quality of the teacher is HIGH. You would probably benefit from someone who can teach you the basics of theory. If you know those things (what are common progressions, what are the chords in each key, basic scales), that will carry you a long way. And it really isn't hard to get under you belt if you take time and ask lots of questions (there are no dumb questions - if you don't know the answer, you need to ask).

Hope that helps.

[Wally]

I always have charts or sheet music in front of me too. I don't think it is a big deal - how many piano players do you know that play from memory :mrgreen: (we actually have one, but he is genius level)

On the other hand, I understand the desire to play from memory and I myself sometimes feel that I am too dependent on the charts. I practice a lot, but I'm not a singer, and a lot of the songs just don't "stick". I do think that the hymns w/ 2 to 4 chord changes per measure are more difficult to memorize than a song w/ 3 or 4 chords total.

Just my $0.02 :lol:

[MrMike]

Once you start to get some theory in your head, you'll find that about 90% of the songs out there are variations on one of about 5 or 6 different themes. They're all built with the same building blocks, just arranged a bit differently.

[ptrallan01]

If your problem is memory as opposed to theory:

Close your eyes and visualize the paper in front of you. As you "look" at the image in your mind your fingers, which are already trained btw, will begin to go to the proper place.

I prefer to learn songs by reading the music but for virtually every song we play in church there is no music so we learn them by ear and by feel. This is also a good way to train your mind and body to work without paper. Learning songs by ear is not as hard as you might think. Use the Kewlpack method of phrase by phrase and add the theory and boom you'll be right there. And I am not a guitarist either just a preacher who loves his plank.

Peter

[seagullplayer]

That's for all the insite. Right now I am working along the lines of what Peter said.
The other guy on our P&W team has a very strong voice, and I have found that if I back off on the singing a little, and listen to him lead, it helps me with correct Chord placement. I don't have so much trouble knowing when to change, (anymore) but rather where to go. I am trying to picture the lead sheet in my head as we go.
I do need to work on theory.

[Larry Wallwart]

Seems like no matter how long I work on a song, I have to have the words and chords on paper infront of me when I'm playing it. I know sometimes I may not even look at the paper, or just a glance now and then, but without it, I wouldn't even know where to start. Anyone have any wisdom on this? I would love to be able to break this habit. I see some guys that can play about any song they know and never look at anything. What's the secret?

BTW; I have already tried green tea, so don't go there. :-)

With me it's about how I learned the song. If I learned the song by listening to a CD and playing along, then I don't need the charts. If I learned the song from charts I need the crutch (even if it's a really really familiar song) Sometimes if it's a simple, repetative chord progression I don't need to look, but for the most part I have to have my crutch.

One thing I've been trying lately mainly at practice is to force myself to not look at the charts. Chances are my hands know where to go, my brain just has this doubt.

Practice, practice, practice

[Larry Wallwart]

P.S.

It's amazing that we can play these songs dozens of times, but when when try to play them without the charts, we go blank. "How does the second verse go?"

[seagullplayer]

P.S.

It's amazing that we can play these songs dozens of times, but when when try to play them without the charts, we go blank. "How does the second verse go?"

That's me.

I have started to make some progress. Two weeks ago I played and sang my first solo without the music in front of me. Slow but steady...